Please help Im feeling defeated and dicouraged

Aug 11, 2021
So earlier I made a post stating how I was getting overwhelmed with my creating and I feel the best way for me to get help is to explain. Fyi im very new at this

Ive just gotten to the point of diluting a bunch of my raw materials so theyre usable. I bought a bunch of dipropylene glycol off creatingperfumes for my dilutions. From talking to a few people they say to use perfumers alcohol or tec(which I dont even know what this is)?
1. Can I use my dpg to dilute my materials? If only for certain materials how do you know what materials to dissolve in what solvent?
2. Ive already diluted some ambroxan, musk ketone, coumarin, and vanillin in dpg none of which actually dissolve. I assume I need heat but not sure how?
3. How do I get labdanum, exaltolide, oakmoss into a bottle to dilute since they are so viscous
4. I diluted pink peppercorn eo in my dpg and ended up shaking it and now its all cloudy, any idea why?

Please any explanation or help with is would be so greatly aplreciated because I feel so lost right now with this whole dilution process because based on good scents companys recommendations I bought the dpg ( alot of it for diluting) and idk even know if I can use it 😥😥 Thank you so much
 

mnitabach

Well-known member
Nov 13, 2020
For beginner's experimentation with EtOH-based fine fragrance, better to dilute these solids in EtOH, at 10% or less. Materials that are very thick viscous & not pourable or pipettable need to be heated gently until they become mobile enough to work with. This can be done in a water bath (bain marie) or (what I do) if you have a cooking oven that can be set at very low temps (like 150-180 degrees F). For diluting botanical E.O.s, absolutes, etc, depending on the amounts typical in a formula, either leave them undiluted if they are mobile enough (such as bergamot which is used typically at high doses) or dilute in EtOH (like peppercorn will be used at very low doses typically). Don't dilute such materials in DPG. There are a few threads very high on the first page of this forum that give a lot of other good advice for beginners.
 
Aug 11, 2021
Its hard to find the right threads to find information on siluting. There is a wide array of info on this site which is great. Can you point me in the right direction possibly or explain why not to use dpg and what etoh is?
 

WestOzDave

Active member
Mar 26, 2021
You can dilute with DPG or with EtoH (Ethanol or Perfumers Alcohol ) But as your finished blends, accords or creations will go into Perfumers Alcohol anyway, its better to not weigh them down with to many additives ..IE DPG ...that may not be needed.
 

polysom

Well-known member
Apr 4, 2021
Its hard to find the right threads to find information on siluting. There is a wide array of info on this site which is great. Can you point me in the right direction possibly or explain why not to use dpg and what etoh is?

EtOH = ethanol. Et comes from "Ethyl", because ethanol = ethyl alcohol. And OH comes from the alcoholic group of the molecule.
 

Najengi

Member
May 31, 2021
Hi there,

There are lots of threads in the archives on diluting materials that I found with sound advice for diluting my first beginner's orders. Check out any posts by David Ruskin in these threads if you can, he is a professional perfumer and I found his guidance/advice bang on helpful. He's very clear on what solvents to use for different materials and at different stages in your perfume making. Here's a link to one of these threads, but there are loads more:

https://www.basenotes.net/threads/372098-Diluting

For getting to know my materials I switched from ethanol dilutions to DPG dilutions because the ethanol was bombing out my smelling nerves too much and making me feel ill. I just do up 10% 5% and 1% dilutions in 5ml dropper bottles so I don't use up too much of my materials and I play around with these every day on smelling strips and skin tests.

It's so easy to go into overwhelm paralysis in the beginning stages. I started with just 10 materials, got to know each one, then moved on to blending 2 of them together, then 3 etc. for a couple of months. Then moved onto the next 10, did the same with those, and then played around with all 20. And reading as much about each material as I'm playing around with them like that. I'm now able to make some simple but nice smelling blends just with those 20 and add them into an ethanol carrier.

And as Sarah McCartney says: Write everything down.

Good Luck x
 

mnitabach

Well-known member
Nov 13, 2020
Hi there,

There are lots of threads in the archives on diluting materials that I found with sound advice for diluting my first beginner's orders. Check out any posts by David Ruskin in these threads if you can, he is a professional perfumer and I found his guidance/advice bang on helpful. He's very clear on what solvents to use for different materials and at different stages in your perfume making. Here's a link to one of these threads, but there are loads more:

https://www.basenotes.net/threads/372098-Diluting

For getting to know my materials I switched from ethanol dilutions to DPG dilutions because the ethanol was bombing out my smelling nerves too much and making me feel ill. I just do up 10% 5% and 1% dilutions in 5ml dropper bottles so I don't use up too much of my materials and I play around with these every day on smelling strips and skin tests.

It's so easy to go into overwhelm paralysis in the beginning stages. I started with just 10 materials, got to know each one, then moved on to blending 2 of them together, then 3 etc. for a couple of months. Then moved onto the next 10, did the same with those, and then played around with all 20. And reading as much about each material as I'm playing around with them like that. I'm now able to make some simple but nice smelling blends just with those 20 and add them into an ethanol carrier.

And as Sarah McCartney says: Write everything down.

Good Luck x

This is one very good possible practice for beginners, and well explained. It is also possible to make good progress learning materials & their interactions not only by spending months studying serial dilutions of individual materials & making binary & trinary blends. Another route is to study simple real accords & even complete fragrances by assembling publicly available formulas & analyzing their internal mechanisms by systematically varying doses & identities of their constituents. I suspect that these different ways of getting started probably suit different personality types & neither is better or worse than the other. And doing both too! But I disagree that it is necessary to refrain from more or less complex blending experiments until after sustained study of serial dilutions of each of the individual materials one wants to work with, altho it is certainly a fine way to proceed. (I personally found it stultifyingly boring... ;-))

And one of the benefits of working sooner than later with well-designed formulas for accords & complete fragrances is that it immediately disabuses the beginner of the seductive idea that the reason their own more complex accords & formulas don't work is because they are lacking some magical ingredient to increase "radiance" or "power" or "projection" or "longevity" or "smoothness" or whatever. When I first started blindly mixing stuff together & it smelled harsh & sharp & bitter, I came on here asking for "sweet molecules" to add to my blends to reverse this. This was obviously completely delusional magical thinking.

BTW: I should say that what I mean is to work with 8-15 line formulas that are simple enough to mechanistically dissect through systematic experimentation what each line is doing, not 30 line behemoths. And yes, write everything down.
 

Najengi

Member
May 31, 2021
I agree, working alongside well designed formulas and accords is a fantastic way to learn and moves things on more. Once I'd familiarised myself with my first 20 diluted aroma chemicals I was indeed able to go on TGSC site download a Fougere demo formula, play with it and do some near substitutions for a couple of the ingredients I didn't have. All in an alcohol base and it smelled divine. Smelled even better the longer I left it to mature. I found once I had that first 10 - 20 materials under my belt, I was genuinely surprised at how easy it was to have a go at it. It really is exciting stuff once you find your feet with it. I haven't got to the 30 liners yet - still early days for me - but I look forward to the day when I have enough materials under my belt to give the behemoth formulas a good bash too.
 

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