Opening up or extending naturals

Jolieo

Basenotes Dependent
Feb 18, 2018
So in my never ending quest to get naturals front and center, I have been thinking about how to do this. Paul has referenced me to the gsmc or coa of the naturals- so many of them are made up of materials that don’t exist in the real world- but in terms of opening up- or extending- I was thinking of trying it with the major constituents of my oils -
which brings me to my query: I have a little formula of galangal, black spruce abs, butter co2, Jasmine tea co2- i pared it way back from the original- and I love it- now I want to open it up before o start adding other components-
the major material in galangal is ETHYL TRANS-P-METHOXYCINNAMATE - which is a derivative of cinnamic acid , which gets me from Wikipedia: honey
and nothing from tgsc
it is the precursor to methyl, ethyl and benzyl cinnamate- which are all more fruity than honey
I am barking up the wrong tree?
i will try with what I have, but these seem stronger than what I want- I just hate to bring an unrelated material in , it defeats the goal - I did want to emphasize and open the galangal but it is made up of such strange bits- the butter to me is already neutral and probably overdosed until I add more materials, the jasmin tea will be next but I don’t have a coa- it’s from hermitage
 

Alex F.

Super Member
Nov 29, 2019
- As for jasmine tea, here's a link to an Analysis of Volatile Components of Jasmine and Jasmine Tea by Zhang et al, 2022: https://www.mdpi.com/1420-3049/27/2/479/pdf

- Re. the (E)-ethyl 4-methoxycinnamate and why it doesn't smell like galangal: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30549600/

If Kaempferia galanga oil is what you have, then I hope that helps and please forget what I wrote before. I don't know that one. The galangal I was thinking about is Alpinia galanga. The constituents I quoted below are for Alpinia galanga and Alpinia officinarum. (I didn't know galangal could refer to 4 different plants of 3 different genera of the ginger family. 😬)

(Had to do some corrections.)
Analyses of galangal oil seem to differ. My go-to source, Tisserand and Young, has 1,8-cineole, camphor, beta- and alpha-pinene and some (+)-limonene among the main constituents.
If you do decide to bring in additional oils: You also get good amounts of 1,8-cineol in certain Ho-leaf chemotypes, laurel leaf,... You get both 1,8-cineole and camphor in spike lavender, so maybe try that. You could also try lime. And rosemary, depending on the CT. Couldn't say which would go well with your other ingredients.
 
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Casper_grassy

Basenotes Dependent
May 5, 2020
This isn’t a bad route to take, though unfortunately sometimes those molecules that make up a natural are difficult to find.
Aside from that you can add certain molecules to “beef up” THOSE SPECIFIC aspects of a natural, however taking into consideration the concentration of a molecule in a natural then adding more, you may get more effect from again that specific aspect, but depending on quality and a slew of variables maybe you’ll end up with + or - a few minutes of duration.

This is really where some synthetics can shine. Regardless of how much photorealism your target is, IMO illusion can play a massive role in the perspective of a fragrance. I was speaking somewhat of this in the thread about safraleine (sorry I know it isn’t a natural, but the idea is the same) I mentioned how safraleine smells like safranal (natural) which smells like saffron (natural). I said to add firsacone because it again smells like saffron and safranal and it has a much power in developing the top of a formula but it doesn’t last that long, however once it dies out (assuming the formula is well constructed) the safraleine will come into play and the sniffer can easily miss the difference that one molecules odor has ended because the safraleine is giving the illusion that the firascone (saffron) is still present. I hope this makes sense, and I know it is two synthetics but again the idea is extremely similar in terms of forming an illusion.
 

Jolieo

Basenotes Dependent
Feb 18, 2018
Kaempferia galanga is what I got - eden offers a coa
of course everything in this one is obscure
Casper- cross referencing is fine- I just still don’t know what to go with
the galangal is a top note- I want to add space in there before I add citrus top and some mids- because this galangal is both fruity and floral, and the combo is really floating my boat
i need a low odor that is perceived top to mid - but since I can’t perceive most low odor- I don’t know what they are doing- so I thought to extend the galangal but that might not go anywhere either since the ones I have aren’t low odor -
I am trying really hard not to add too much- although my out of the gate one worked pretty well- I have no clue why it worked so I am going backwards- because I will have to add more 1) to be able to afford it
2) to get a bit more volume
3) to maybe get a bit more silliage
 
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