1st time posting a small liner formula - appreciate feedback and advice..

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
Hello to everyone, I hope your doing well and staying healthy,
To avoid saying “I” much, I was tentative always to share of what I tried to such place with so many experienced ones here, but, have to do it sometime, here goes,

- amber xtreeme - 42
- iso e supper - 20
- vetiver (haiti) - 10
- vetiveryl acetate - 14
- vetiver absolute - 1
- amyris wood (haiti) - 2
- ethylene brassylate - 10
- ethyl vanillin - 4
- castoreum blend (50% bb) - 1
- labdanum resinoid (50% tec) - 8
- sichuan pepper (robertet) - 2.5
- ambrarome absolute (synarome) - 1
- elemi sfe (firmenich) - 1

No dilution, except where stated,
The result is promising, Im building it as base btw, I want to expand on this to a perfume formula, but not now, the smell is sort of smooth earthy scent! with unusual amber smoke nuance!

let me know your thoughts and advice, and if I missed anything or should amend somethings,

thank you 🙏
 

ScentAle

Basenotes Junkie
Oct 26, 2021
In some compositions i really like the amber xtreme overdose, but I never used a dose high like this.
If you like olibanum i think some olibanum materials can be nice. Also the usually vertofix and piconia are good with vetiver. Amber xtreme can produce interesting effect with resins.
If you like, you can add an aromatic earthy note with terrasol, or you can add a touch of geosmin for enhance the earthy wet. Cashmeran and/or something camphor will add diffusion with the already sichouan.
If you want to have more "vanille abs" smell, ultravanil is a good beast.
And a tricky one, i found that one very small touch of tuberose with smoky materials, can give some unique effects.
 

David Ruskin

Basenotes Institution
May 28, 2009
You say that this formula is only part of the finished fragrance, and is the Base note part. Can you tell us how much of this will be in the final fragrance? As others have noted, that is an enormous amount of Amber Xtreme, which is likely to dominate anything else. Of course, if you like the effect then carry on, but be aware of potential problems ahead.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
In some compositions i really like the amber xtreme overdose, but I never used a dose high like this.
If you like olibanum i think some olibanum materials can be nice. Also the usually vertofix and piconia are good with vetiver. Amber xtreme can produce interesting effect with resins.
If you like, you can add an aromatic earthy note with terrasol, or you can add a touch of geosmin for enhance the earthy wet. Cashmeran and/or something camphor will add diffusion with the already sichouan.
If you want to have more "vanille abs" smell, ultravanil is a good beast.
And a tricky one, i found that one very small touch of tuberose with smoky materials, can give some unique effects.
More than interesting and informative.. amazing details to work with! Thank you kindly 🙏
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
You say that this formula is only part of the finished fragrance, and is the Base note part. Can you tell us how much of this will be in the final fragrance? As others have noted, that is an enormous amount of Amber Xtreme, which is likely to dominate anything else. Of course, if you like the effect then carry on, but be aware of potential problems ahead.
No I meant to be a part of fragrance in general in future :) nothing ready now!
I wanted to create something which I can use in different manners in future.. some of the recommendations up would easily allow me to reduce the amber xtreeme! In general, and I will reduce again in specific to this formula!
the interesting part about this is not the beginning, is actually after few days! The amber almost merge with the overall scent! Rather than taking over! If I increase iso e supper the scent goes way off
or the ethyl vanillin or ethylene brassylate it becomes sweet and gourmand with earth which is 🤢
The amber worked better with the increase!
but, I wrote it for exactly having feedback, and I’ll try again!

I was expecting a harsher rain down 😅🤣 🙏🙏🙏
not from you , I mean in general replies
 

pkiler

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Dec 5, 2007
I think that my feedback is that it seems like a wholelotta Amber Extreme.
And also, it is difficult to diagnose only a small bit of a fragrance, when I don't know what the rest of the fragrance would be like.
I would have to make it, really, to have further input.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I think that my feedback is that it seems like a wholelotta Amber Extreme.
And also, it is difficult to diagnose only a small bit of a fragrance, when I don't know what the rest of the fragrance would be like.
I would have to make it, really, to have further input.
Yes that would be great if you got the chance to try it, I would love to know the assessment hands on
No perfume here, it’s something I was working at to have as a small base, if I can call it that, and which might be used in future for different purposes, and possibly expanding it into a more formed perfume formula!
scentAle gave me so many alternatives or additions to consider! I will try tomorrow!
 

mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
I am being completely honest here: this formula looks super dense & heavy & not really giving hints of interesting contrasts or anything particularly lively. Maybe I'm totally wrong, but reading it I'm not motivated to assemble & test it.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I am being completely honest here: this formula looks super dense & heavy & not really giving hints of interesting contrasts or anything particularly lively. Maybe I'm totally wrong, but reading it I'm not motivated to assemble & test it.
Honesty never hurts! Appreciate your comment too!
Im always prepared for failure and comments, this is the best way to asses, amend and hopefully reach to a place in the near future were when I share again you might be motivated to assemble and try!
Cheers
 

mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
Honesty never hurts! Appreciate your comment too!
Im always prepared for failure and comments, this is the best way to asses, amend and hopefully reach to a place in the near future were when I share again you might be motivated to assemble and try!
Cheers
It is currently just words & numbers on the page, so I could totally be wrong!
 

pkiler

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Dec 5, 2007
Yes that would be great if you got the chance to try it, I would love to know the assessment hands on
Then I will be brutally honest.
Instead of 42 Amber Extreme, I would put 4.2 amber extreme, and still wince at that amount.
 

rococo

Basenotes Member
Jan 1, 2010
Are you sure you didn't accidentally mix up your amber xtreme and amyris? That is the only explanation I can come up with for how this smells like anything other than amber xtreme...

if you are sure, then might I suggest reversing the proportions of amber xtreme and amyris anyway?

edit: are you sure it is amber xtreme and not a different amber material? not trying to be condescending! Between sylvamber, fixamber, ambrox and ambrocenide and amber core and amber xtreme it's chaos
 

mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
Are you sure you didn't accidentally mix up your amber xtreme and amyris? That is the only explanation I can come up with for how this smells like anything other than amber xtreme...

if you are sure, then might I suggest reversing the proportions of amber xtreme and amyris anyway?

edit: are you sure it is amber xtreme and not a different amber material? not trying to be condescending! Between sylvamber, fixamber, ambrox and ambrocenide and amber core and amber xtreme it's chaos
If this were ambercore or boisambrene forte, it would make a hell of a lot more sense.
 

deroudist

Super Member
Dec 20, 2021
As posted by others before, this amount of Amber Xtreme is nose numbing. There are instances were overdoses of materials like this work (i am looking at your, Alessandro Gualtieri). But on paper (just from looking at it) it is too likely that the Amber Xtreme is running over everything else underneath it. If it (Amber Xtreme) were diluted at 10%, i might gave the composition a chance.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I really believe there’s something wrong! I’m reviewing my notes on the application software, I have amber Xtreme note that use up 0.5% to 1%
I will have to recheck my materials! Most probable that it’s diluted either to 10% or 5% And I failed to mention and worst is to notice to mention!

because one material opoponax sweet myrh that I have several dilutions of it, I tried 5% one and it gave an additional sweet scent I didn’t want!

100% it’s not correct 42 neat! I’ll check and let you know! And not just saying that because you all said something is wrong, but because something is wrong.

it’s all PK fault, I was following the work in neat materials 🤣😅🤣 (joking)

thank you all 🙏
 

mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
I really believe there’s something wrong! I’m reviewing my notes on the application software, I have amber Xtreme note that use up 0.5% to 1%
I will have to recheck my materials! Most probable that it’s diluted either to 10% or 5% And I failed to mention and worst is to notice to mention!

because one material opoponax sweet myrh that I have several dilutions of it, I tried 5% one and it gave an additional sweet scent I didn’t want!

100% it’s not correct 42 neat! I’ll check and let you know! And not just saying that because you all said something is wrong, but because something is wrong.

it’s all PK fault, I was following the work in neat materials 🤣😅🤣 (joking)

thank you all 🙏
This is an object lesson in what happens if you use magic spreadsheets to do all your math: you never develop correct intuitions about your material dosing & waste your own time & that of others. If you write out all your formulas by hand & do the math (which is absolutely only the most trivial arithmetic) with a calculator, you learn to think in percent/ppt & develop robust correct intuitions.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
This is an object lesson in what happens if you use magic spreadsheets to do all your math: you never develop correct intuitions about your material dosing & waste your own time & that of others. If you write out all your formulas by hand & do the math (which is absolutely only the most trivial arithmetic) with a calculator, you learn to think in percent/ppt & develop robust correct intuitions.
Agreed, but it’s far from that believe me, at first sincere apologies if I wasted anyone’s time! Not my Intention, and I take Mike note here in the positive manner, I know it’s an advice!
and I agree, for intuition part, that’s why I scratched some days ago my approach from pre-owned formulas and accords which I was working with, and restarted from scratch!

but I think there’s something wrong with my materials! Not only amber
many other materials doesn’t seem to be correct! I dont really know what’s wrong here, as it’s a mix of things before I took notes with one’s new! Hmm is a compound mistake interest!

i have to scratch all of the ones I filled into glass bottles! 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

I will try to repurpose it for home fragrance, or for robot cleaner water tank etc… even the IES was wrong!
I know for sure IES and Amber are wrong! The rest are correct because I took it from original bottles
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I will re-work it again and share it more accurately! And I will try some of the materials mentioned! But I want to work at mine first 💪
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
No never, I’m so what sort of lover of failures.. (realistic ones) like this case, or new projects I do at my work! Easy and clean way to learn!

I fail miserably at singing, (except when showering) but I understand that this is something I can’t really do much about, so I change the premise and learned guitar!

thank you for the encouragement, it’s always great to hear some! 💪
 

mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
Agreed, but it’s far from that believe me, at first sincere apologies if I wasted anyone’s time! Not my Intention, and I take Mike note here in the positive manner, I know it’s an advice!
and I agree, for intuition part, that’s why I scratched some days ago my approach from pre-owned formulas and accords which I was working with, and restarted from scratch!

but I think there’s something wrong with my materials! Not only amber
many other materials doesn’t seem to be correct! I dont really know what’s wrong here, as it’s a mix of things before I took notes with one’s new! Hmm is a compound mistake interest!

i have to scratch all of the ones I filled into glass bottles! 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️

I will try to repurpose it for home fragrance, or for robot cleaner water tank etc… even the IES was wrong!
I know for sure IES and Amber are wrong! The rest are correct because I took it from original bottles
I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to say, but if it is that your dilutions are wrong, then yes that obvs makes perfumery impossible. And BTW, if this is what you are trying to say, I cannot think of any possible reason why you would be diluting a low-impact material like IES in the first place. Finally, of course I agree with the encouragement! F'ing everything up is part of the learning process!
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I'm not exactly sure what you are trying to say, but if it is that your dilutions are wrong, then yes that obvs makes perfumery impossible. And BTW, if this is what you are trying to say, I cannot think of any possible reason why you would be diluting a low-impact material like IES in the first place. Finally, of course I agree with the encouragement! F'ing everything up is part of the learning process!
hmm, I will try show you, maybe makes more sense!
now I’m working only neat.. as I receive from suppliers bottles!

previously I was working with dilutions and neat materials! taking from suppliers bottles and putting in smaller 30ml bottles neat and in dilutions!

the Mistake here, I had so many 30 ml bottles, when I started working neat, I took all the dilution ones, but, there might be a mistake from the ones I kept which are not neat! I am really not sure at all! hence, best, to Re-address all my bottles!

as an example! between from supplier or adjusted!

IES is wrong and amber xtreeme is wrong, as I compared the 30ml with originals from suppliers

the Other mentioned up, are correct, because I took directly from the original bottle!

IES wasnt Low impact when I was using the dilution phase! I used it at 20% and 50% before, but those were in pre-defined formulas! Which is not learning tp say so

Still, though I wouldn’t say F,ing up! i would say mistake.. is not far one, just to be amended accordingly! i Like to think so!

#long #breath
 

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mnitabach

Basenotes Plus
Basenotes Plus
Nov 13, 2020
hmm, I will try show you, maybe makes more sense!
now I’m working only neat.. as I receive from suppliers bottles!

previously I was working with dilutions and neat materials! taking from suppliers bottles and putting in smaller 30ml bottles neat and in dilutions!

the Mistake here, I had so many 30 ml bottles, when I started working neat, I took all the dilution ones, but, there might be a mistake from the ones I kept which are not neat! I am really not sure at all! hence, best, to Re-address all my bottles!

as an example! between from supplier or adjusted!

IES is wrong and amber xtreeme is wrong, as I compared the 30ml with originals from suppliers

the Other mentioned up, are correct, because I took directly from the original bottle!

IES wasnt Low impact when I was using the dilution phase! I used it at 20% and 50% before, but those were in pre-defined formulas! Which is not learning tp say so

Still, though I wouldn’t say F,ing up! i would say mistake.. is not far one, just to be amended accordingly! i Like to think so!

#long #breath
I still pretty much have only a vague idea what you are trying to say... But if you are saying that you prepared 20% & 50% dilutions of IES for use in "pre-defined formulas", this makes absolutely no sense at all. First, there is absolutely no plausible scenario under which it would ever make sense to prepare 20% or 50% (or any other dilution) IES for use in assembling formulas. Second, I have carefully looked at what is probably the vast majority of perfume formulas publicly available on the internet and in books (and certainly every single one on TGSC), and never once seen IES listed in diluted form. Third, if you are going to make diluted stocks, obviously you have to carefully label them with the dilution.
 

editorinscent

Basenotes Dependent
Oct 3, 2007
Hello to everyone, I hope your doing well and staying healthy,
To avoid saying “I” much, I was tentative always to share of what I tried to such place with so many experienced ones here, but, have to do it sometime, here goes,

- amber xtreeme - 42
- iso e supper - 20
- vetiver (haiti) - 10
- vetiveryl acetate - 14
- vetiver absolute - 1
- amyris wood (haiti) - 2
- ethylene brassylate - 10
- ethyl vanillin - 4
- castoreum blend (50% bb) - 1
- labdanum resinoid (50% tec) - 8
- sichuan pepper (robertet) - 2.5
- ambrarome absolute (synarome) - 1
- elemi sfe (firmenich) - 1

No dilution, except where stated,
The result is promising, Im building it as base btw, I want to expand on this to a perfume formula, but not now, the smell is sort of smooth earthy scent! with unusual amber smoke nuance!

let me know your thoughts and advice, and if I missed anything or should amend somethings,

thank you 🙏
Well, for starters this doesn't add to 100 or 1000, which is a best practice for perfumery. And wow that's a ton of Amber Xtreme, try diluting it to 10% or even 1% and re-evaluate the formula. I would also recommend scaling your formula to parts / 1000.
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
I still pretty much have only a vague idea what you are trying to say... But if you are saying that you prepared 20% & 50% dilutions of IES for use in "pre-defined formulas", this makes absolutely no sense at all. First, there is absolutely no plausible scenario under which it would ever make sense to prepare 20% or 50% (or any other dilution) IES for use in assembling formulas. Second, I have carefully looked at what is probably the vast majority of perfume formulas publicly available on the internet and in books (and certainly every single one on TGSC), and never once seen IES listed in diluted form. Third, if you are going to make diluted stocks, obviously you have to carefully label them with the dilution.
😪😪 okay! short story theres a mistake and I’ll fix it! There we go
 

LaFou

Focus your thoughts, & wonders will appear
Basenotes Plus
Sep 18, 2022
Well, for starters this doesn't add to 100 or 1000, which is a best practice for perfumery. And wow that's a ton of Amber Xtreme, try diluting it to 10% or even 1% and re-evaluate the formula. I would also recommend scaling your formula to parts / 1000.
No need to add 100 or 1000 ! You can do something that adds 678 and still works! And you are right High amount I’ll work it out!
ill consider it the ppt too, thanks

is not a formula of anything per say, is something I wanted to do which I can use in the future differently!

im learning to create pleasant scents or base if I may say!
thanks again
 

editorinscent

Basenotes Dependent
Oct 3, 2007
No need to add 100 or 1000 ! You can do something that adds 678 and still works! And you are right High amount I’ll work it out!
ill consider it the ppt too, thanks

is not a formula of anything per say, is something I wanted to do which I can use in the future differently!

im learning to create pleasant scents or base if I may say!
thanks again
While that's true, it's in best practice (especially for compounding) to have the total formula add to 1000. You can add solvent for the remainder when you're done. It also leaves room for "cushion" so you can add to / revise the formula in later iterations.
 

ourmess

Basenotes Junkie
Apr 25, 2018
While that's true, it's in best practice (especially for compounding) to have the total formula add to 1000.
That's fairly meaningless; you can make a formula that's finished at 837 parts and then trivially easily convert it to ppt.

Ultimately "parts" are meaningless and it's all percentages anyway. Yes, I understand the irony that percentages are also parts but you know what I mean. ;p
 
Jan 8, 2023
I’m interested to hear if you can re-create it with the proper numbers of amounts of what at what dilution. Because I will say that it sounds like you are interested in creating some really cool niche scents. I am also at the beginning of my perfuming and love creating similar niche fragrances, but I also love learning about best practices in perfuming from the hundreds of years of the modern practice.

Will you let me know how it goes? Really would love to know. :)
 

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