Hyraceum 60% dipg (firmenich)

[Gadgets82]

So like ive said to everyone im pretty new at this stuff. I have come and gone a few times without notice. I saw that there wasnt alot of talk about hyraceum.

I have been in contact with Travis at PA for almost a year now, going back and forth about hyraceum, how much i think its underrated as a musk, and overlooked in favor of civet, castoreum and the likes.

I love hyraceum, in dilution ime it is powdery, hay like and warm. Well a couple weeks ago Travis emailed me to let me know that PA has added Hyraceum Absolute 60% dipg (firmenich), I believe its the same that PSH carries as well. I think he got tired of me pestering them about it lol.

I just didnt see anyone else post it, so I figured I would.

https://shop.perfumersapprentice.com/p-10112-hyraceum-absolute-60-dipg-firmenich.aspx

 

[jfrater]

It's an interesting product but I would far prefer to use a slightly aged tincture (at least one year) as there are top notes in the Firmenich hyraceum abs that I find very unpleasant. The tincture has none of those notes and adds wonderful honey sweetness especially as it ages.

 

[Gadgets82]

It's an interesting product but I would far prefer to use a slightly aged tincture (at least one year) as there are top notes in the Firmenich hyraceum abs that I find very unpleasant. The tincture has none of those notes and adds wonderful honey sweetness especially as it ages.

Funny you should say that mr frater, i actually had made a hyraceum tincture (though only 6 months), from raw hyraceum from apothercarys garden. Its what started my love affair with the material.

Edit: just checked i actually still have about 3 oz raw hyraceum my last order from apothecarys garden. Now im gonna start a new tincture 😁

 

[parker25mv]

If anyone is trying to look into synthetic ACs, civettone, phenylacetic acid, para-cresyl acetate, a light dose of indole, perhaps a hint of vanillin, are some to consider.

"Synarome's most infamous classic "perfumer's base" though is Animalis, from which the term "animalic fragrances" has sprung; a feral, thick ambery yellow liquid, mostly insoluble in water but easily soluble in alcohol, with prominent civet and castoreum (both traditionally animal-derived products), a cluster of musks and with costus root, a plant essence that has an uncanny resemblance to a mix of unwashed human hair, goat smell and dirty socks. The presence of phenolic-smelling, para cresol molecules also indicates a tannery tar & barnyard "stink". And yet the effect of the finished accord is envelopingly fur-like, powdery musky, warm, powerful, rich, decadent and yes, very animalic-smelling."
"Modern Animalis perfume base includes 10-undecanal, linalool, alpha-pinene, β-Caryophyllene, limonene, heaps of cedrol and cedrene alpha. Mysteriously enough the final result ends up smelling animalic"

http://perfumeshrine.blogspot.com/2012/05/perfumers-base-animalis-by-synarome.html

Hyraceum is said to contain coumarins, but one comment I found seemed to suggest the AC bicyclononalactone may be just a little more reminiscent of the hyraceum smell.

another blog that may be of interest just for curiosity sake

http://africanaromatics.com/hyraceum-eau-de-dassie/

 

[Gadgets82]

Btw Mr Frater,
I have been looking over your store, bc you are the only person that carries neobutenone alpha apparently. I did have a question for a more natural ambergris, should i go with your own ambrexol or ambrofix?

 

[jfrater]

Btw Mr Frater,
I have been looking over your store, bc you are the only person that carries neobutenone alpha apparently. I did have a question for a more natural ambergris, should i go with your own ambrexol or ambrofix?

For the most true to life ambergris you want Absolute Ambergris which recreates the full odour of tincture of aged ambergris resin (the resin tincture was a special extra precious form of ambergris tincture). Ambrexol is more for people needing the old type of Fixateur 404 (a light weight base that adds perfumistic quality with far less of an odour contribution). Generally I use a combination of Absolute Ambergris for the true animalic note with all the power of natural ambergris, and Ambrofix crystals for overdosing ALA Aventus - you can use Ambrofix in the same way you use Iso E Super or in very small amounts for its fixative and exalting power.

Absolute Ambergris is an animalic base, and Ambrofix (ambroxan, ambroxide, ambrox etc) is a single molecule. Ambrofix is the finest form of ambrox on the market - surpassing even Firmenich's products. Firmenich has a captive Ambrox which is not on the market for the general public - but Ambrofix is very close. That captive version is what they used in Aventus along with a captive form of Helvetolide, etc.

 

[Gadgets82]

For the most true to life ambergris you want Absolute Ambergris which recreates the full odour of tincture of aged ambergris resin (the resin tincture was a special extra precious form of ambergris tincture). Ambrexol is more for people needing the old type of Fixateur 404 (a light weight base that adds perfumistic quality with far less of an odour contribution). Generally I use a combination of Absolute Ambergris for the true animalic note with all the power of natural ambergris, and Ambrofix crystals for overdosing ALA Aventus - you can use Ambrofix in the same way you use Iso E Super or in very small amounts for its fixative and exalting power.

Absolute Ambergris is an animalic base, and Ambrofix (ambroxan, ambroxide, ambrox etc) is a single molecule. Ambrofix is the finest form of ambrox on the market - surpassing even Firmenich's products. Firmenich has a captive Ambrox which is not on the market for the general public - but Ambrofix is very close. That captive version is what they used in Aventus along with a captive form of Helvetolide, etc.

Thank you for your insight!
Your store has a ton of material i want to use im glad i took a look.
Thanks for providing those materials.

 

[parker25mv]

jfrater had this to say in different thread:
"tetrahydro para methyl quinoline [...] wow - this is one of the most amazing complex materials I have smelt. It definitely does have a civet note to it, but more importantly it smells like a gentleman's club full of old and fresh cigar smoke and chocolate."
Fascinating Material: Tetrahydro Para Methyl Quinoline (Sep 7, 2015)

jfrater, do you think this AC could be useful (at very low levels) in a hyraceum accord?


(what kind of struck me was the comparison between the molecular structure of tetrahydro para methyl quinoline versus 6-methyl quinoline, or other regular quinoline ACs such as IBQ, compared to the difference between bicyclononalactone and coumarin. Apparently making it less aromatic [referring to chemistry terminology, not smell] and adding hydrogen results in a more animalic feel?)