All Things Ensar Oud

[james1051]

for example in EO1 if you send it for gcms youll find use of some synths

Oh come on. To make a post like this one anonymously, and without posting your testing results? not good. Post your proof.

 

[Proust_Madeleine]

to me elixir is my favorite perfumer because personally i like prin and ald but can find quite a few compositions dominated by singular notes that can feel synthetic to me. i don’t feel this is the case with elixir and he uses those high quality ingredients with more nuance IMO.

Did you like the elixir releases that used synthetics? The one that I sampled thanks to a friend on this board were not very good, imho. Soured me a bit on the brand. Which is too bad. The natural ones are pretty good.

Subtle synthetic usage is way harder than people give it credit for, natural perfumers often overdose the synths especially when they start using them. I even think the solafa jams are a little bit unbalanced with the ACs.

I do think ALD and Prin do a much better job with aroma chems. Sultan pasha too.

 

[slater93]

i’m sure taste plays a big role here and i appreciate all the perfumers you listed in their own way and for their own styles.

prin can be too bombastic and the amount of synthetics can dominate and be overly linear, though his best compositions are so good it can be hard to care. i know i’m in the minority but i find OG mriga so synthetic dominant it’s intolerable and a scrubber as an example of something that doesn’t work for me that is a hit for most others. love many others like homa and mando, NP.

SPA i have a love hate relationship with, a lot of his stuff can feel too classical for me or like explicitly feminine in an old lady way (especially al lail for example) when i usually don’t care much one way or the other. but fougere noir and batsmati rose are 10/10 perfect to me.

following elixir i think his progress is what has enthralled me the most (i hope this for the future of solafa).

would be curious what you sampled while if you may have tried something like the nahawand series, iris chypre, mythique or spirit of japan (earlier compositions which i assume he was still honing his synthetic usage), all of which i like and own but have some issue with all of the above and are not loves, in general i think it’s very much my style though i would agree this stage needs refinement and points to the truth of difficulty skillfully integrating synthetics into a composition.

that being said his newer perfumes have really shined for me and quickly become favorites that show growth and retain natural characteristics while projecting really well while maintaining nuance. corduene, apres les soir and manuka all would appear in my top ten of all time personally and im quite sure they all contain synthetics in a very controlled manner. but i seem to be in the minority of having him as my favorite perfumer among the general crowd he’s a part of.

if you end up trying any of those i’d love to hear your feedback as the internet seems short on reviews of his work so i really have no idea what the community at large may feel but that is my biased 2 cents

 

[haope]

following elixir i think his progress is what has enthralled me the most (i hope this for the future of solafa).

would be curious what you sampled while if you may have tried something like the nahawand series, iris chypre, mythique or spirit of japan (earlier compositions which i assume he was still honing his synthetic usage), all of which i like and own but have some issue with all of the above and are not loves, in general i think it’s very much my style though i would agree this stage needs refinement and points to the truth of difficulty skillfully integrating synthetics into a composition.

that being said his newer perfumes have really shined for me and quickly become favorites that show growth and retain natural characteristics while projecting really well while maintaining nuance. corduene, apres les soir and manuka all would appear in my top ten of all time personally and im quite sure they all contain synthetics in a very controlled manner. but i seem to be in the minority of having him as my favorite perfumer among the general crowd he’s a part of.

if you end up trying any of those i’d love to hear your feedback as the internet seems short on reviews of his work so i really have no idea what the community at large may feel but that is my biased 2 cents

Agree with you on elixir attar’s progress, he’s only gotten better throughout the years.

As for his synth usage, if the perfume contains synthetics hes upfront about declaring it, so really only nahawand i think.
Iris chypre i thought there were synths used due to this scratchy woodiness i got at the base, but after speaking with Ahmed it’s apparently a sensitivity to the natural isolates he used - so still natural origin.

I think he’s fantastic at utilising both naturals and synthetics, really shows a mastery of both but the newer ones u listed like corduene or apres les soir are all natural. I actually asked him to use some synths in my bespoke to boost the performance, he handled it perfectly.

He’s without a doubt my favourite perfumer as well as a delight to talk to. Feel free to pm me to discuss his work more, let’s try to keep the thread on track.


As for the chemical analysis of eo1, i’ll check if its alright to post it here. If not, feel free to disregard everything I said earlier. People are free to believe what they wish, there’s certainly no reason to take my word if I can’t produce proof.

 

[epigeneticmutant]

lol this whole thread is full of people speculating wildly, fyi i remember elixir himself was who did those testings iirc, and to detect aromachemicals means to detect distinct peaks and elution times etc for constituent molecules, many of which exist in both nature and aromachemicals available to buy by the drum as the identical molecules, i.e. ingredients in rose essential oil or a myriad of other essential oils. the gcms cannot detect synthetic vs natural versions of a material besides the leftover molecules that may be left in an absolute or distillate, but considering you are analyzing a complex mixture of many ingredients in the bottles perfume solution, some of which it seems we all agree are natural, you will see some impurities or residuals regardless. only distinct aromachemicals that don't exist in nature can be detected and lead to a confirmation of synthetics in the solution being analyzed. somebody could replace a real essential oil with the synthetic version and gcms will be ignorant if it's already in a complex mixture containing naturals that contain extras you wouldn't get in a single aromachemical. from the sounds of this discussion it seems people have very little experience in organic chemistry and analytical chemistry and are just weighing in to cheer their favorite leader on (be it ensar or elixir etc.)

bottom line, buy what you like and what makes you happy, don't get so worked up in all the words any vendors tell you, be your own judge, and most importantly don't let the crowd sway you with a bandwagon effect or emotionally driven arguments, this isn't politics, this is a fun hobby, or should be.

 

[Proust_Madeleine]

He’s without a doubt my favourite perfumer as well as a delight to talk to. Feel free to pm me to discuss his work more, let’s try to keep the thread on track.


As for the chemical analysis of eo1, i’ll check if its alright to post it here. If not, feel free to disregard everything I said earlier. People are free to believe what they wish, there’s certainly no reason to take my word if I can’t produce proof.

Oh man, this whole discussion is just another time for an Oud vendor to attack eo; this time with a couple of Elixir fans or fronts in here, coordinating? That’s incredibly boring — and I’m not saying Ensar doesn’t have it coming as someone who attacks other vendors. But seriously can we keep this petty backbiting stuff off basenotes?

All I can say about elixir is that I’m glad he’s improving and is very good now. The one(I actually think it was two, including nahawand) I tried with synths was incredibly amateurish and had no grasp of how to handle synthetics— and this is coming from someone who doesn’t prefer natural or modern perfumery. I just want it to be well done. I always liked elixir’s rough around the edges stuff. I think Iris Chypre is great. And spirit of Japan. And I’m open to trying newer stuff and being made into a believer.

But this kind of nonsense makes me think I’d rather not ever touch elixir again. Doing GCMS of other people’s work(or at least claiming to)? Then having your fans go out and report in their threads? Ughhh this is the stuff that made me want to abandon the Oud world altogether.

 

[haope]

lol this whole thread is full of people speculating wildly, fyi i remember elixir himself was who did those testings iirc, and to detect aromachemicals means to detect distinct peaks and elution times etc for constituent molecules, many of which exist in both nature and aromachemicals available to buy by the drum as the identical molecules, i.e. ingredients in rose essential oil or a myriad of other essential oils. the gcms cannot detect synthetic vs natural versions of a material besides the leftover molecules that may be left in an absolute or distillate, but considering you are analyzing a complex mixture of many ingredients in the bottles perfume solution, some of which it seems we all agree are natural, you will see some impurities or residuals regardless. only distinct aromachemicals that don't exist in nature can be detected and lead to a confirmation of synthetics in the solution being analyzed. somebody could replace a real essential oil with the synthetic version and gcms will be ignorant if it's already in a complex mixture containing naturals that contain extras you wouldn't get in a single aromachemical. from the sounds of this discussion it seems people have very little experience in organic chemistry and analytical chemistry and are just weighing in to cheer their favorite leader on (be it ensar or elixir etc.)

bottom line, buy what you like and what makes you happy, don't get so worked up in all the words any vendors tell you, be your own judge, and most importantly don't let the crowd sway you with a bandwagon effect or emotionally driven arguments, this isn't politics, this is a fun hobby, or should be.

Fair enough, I was wrong. Thank you for educating me. In the absence of any conclusive evidence, there’s no reason to doubt ensar’s claims. Apologies to ensar and his brand, I’ll retract my earlier statements.

 

[slater93]

yeah, i apologize for mentioning the word “synthetic” and “ensar”, i didn’t realize it would cause this kind of a bickering battle on all sides. it wasn’t my intention at all and was only suggesting it could be a good idea since, as myself and many others note, he can struggle with projection and longevity in some perfumes. the oud world is a very judgmental and hauty space, as was also the case with the agar aura duel a few days ago and it’s a bummer that that is the case. apologies to all.

 

[haope]

yeah, i apologize for mentioning the word “synthetic” and “ensar”, i didn’t realize it would cause this kind of a bickering battle on all sides. it wasn’t my intention at all and was only suggesting it could be a good idea since, as myself and many others note, he can struggle with projection and longevity in some perfumes. the oud world is a very judgmental and hauty space, as was also the case with the agar aura duel a few days ago and it’s a bummer that that is the case. apologies to all.

nothing to apologise for on your part. It’s my fault for jumping to conclusions and making unfair claims.

 

[In Amber]

nothing to apologise for on your part. It’s my fault for jumping to conclusions and making unfair claims.

you're backtracking a little here from saying you had proof to saying you jumped to conclusions . Anyhow I agree with Proust here , grown men (and yes it is always men ) taking anonymous sniper shots and bickering about perfume is all a bit sad and takes away from something that should be a pleasure

 

[Elixir.Attar]

Oh man, this whole discussion is just another time for an Oud vendor to attack eo; this time with a couple of Elixir fans or fronts in here, coordinating? That’s incredibly boring — and I’m not saying Ensar doesn’t have it coming as someone who attacks other vendors. But seriously can we keep this petty backbiting stuff off basenotes?

All I can say about elixir is that I’m glad he’s improving and is very good now. The one(I actually think it was two, including nahawand) I tried with synths was incredibly amateurish and had no grasp of how to handle synthetics— and this is coming from someone who doesn’t prefer natural or modern perfumery. I just want it to be well done. I always liked elixir’s rough around the edges stuff. I think Iris Chypre is great. And spirit of Japan. And I’m open to trying newer stuff and being made into a believer.

But this kind of nonsense makes me think I’d rather not ever touch elixir again. Doing GCMS of other people’s work(or at least claiming to)? Then having your fans go out and report in their threads? Ughhh this is the stuff that made me want to abandon the Oud world altogether.

 

[Elixir.Attar]

Hello dear Proust

First of all, thank God, i did not send anyone on my behalf, honest to God,
Second, Ensar, Sultan Pasha, Russian Adam, AlShareef, JK, Taha, and everyone else i did not mention are people who are respected and has his own following in the community, and if you like his things thats good for you, and i did like many of his things as well in the past, and i have no hard feelings for anyone thank God. Not to Ensar or anyone else for that matter.

Third, about synthetics etc. i will not talk about this subject positively or negatively, i dont like talking about other brands , and even if we have had some small fights in the past, i will try as best i can to abstain from any talk about other brands either positive or negative- in the past i did the mistake of engaging publicly with other brands and its just a waste of energy.

The only thing i would say is, the only case i would clarify the usage of synthetics would be in a private setting if somebody showed me a perfume and i have the means to show it has or not, and this is due to the nature of our perfumery course, science is science, if there is X we say there is X, if there is Y, we say there is Y, not because we seek defamation, but because also we cannot teach people wrongly in a perfumery course saying this sample which is analyzed has no synthetics when it has is lying, and this is not INSINUATING ANY COMPANY, suppose you are my student and sent me a vial from any company saying to me please analyze it for me and paid me to analyze it, would you like if i lyingly told you it is 100% natural even it has synthetics, specially when you are learning?
A question to ponder….

Even educationally speaking, i used to post videos about oud etc. , now i dont because i believe who wants to learn should seek knowledge and i dont want to “impart” wisdom or knowledge on people forcibly.

About our perfumes which you tried in the past , loved or hated, we as a company respect your opinion because at the end of the day we have a saying that “without differing opinions the world would go bad”, and that is perfectly true.

Finally, i would like to apologize to anyone who i may have spoken bad about intentionally or not in the past.

 

[thesacredsaguaro]

Everyone’s bout to get a wild rant in their emails today from the EO team.

 

[slater93]

Oh man, this whole discussion is just another time for an Oud vendor to attack eo; this time with a couple of Elixir fans or fronts in here, coordinating? That’s incredibly boring — and I’m not saying Ensar doesn’t have it coming as someone who attacks other vendors. But seriously can we keep this petty backbiting stuff off basenotes?

All I can say about elixir is that I’m glad he’s improving and is very good now. The one(I actually think it was two, including nahawand) I tried with synths was incredibly amateurish and had no grasp of how to handle synthetics— and this is coming from someone who doesn’t prefer natural or modern perfumery. I just want it to be well done. I always liked elixir’s rough around the edges stuff. I think Iris Chypre is great. And spirit of Japan. And I’m open to trying newer stuff and being made into a believer.

But this kind of nonsense makes me think I’d rather not ever touch elixir again. Doing GCMS of other people’s work(or at least claiming to)? Then having your fans go out and report in their threads? Ughhh this is the stuff that made me want to abandon the Oud world altogether.

i also just want to say rereading your post since i, too, am against conjecture and gossip. there was no coordination here whatsoever.

i’m just a person who likes multiple perfumers, including some of ensars work which is why i’m in here providing some feedback as a consumer of ensars work, with plenty of positive feedback.

i’m not some fanboy that is reiterating perspectives that either are not my own or were coordinated in any fashion and i don’t think it’s in good taste to make suggestions in that vein.

 

[Xcaliber6685]

The only thing i would say is, the only case i would clarify the usage of synthetics would be in a private setting if somebody showed me a perfume and i have the means to show it has or not, and this is due to the nature of our perfumery course, science is science, if there is X we say there is X, if there is Y, we say there is Y, not because we seek defamation, but because also we cannot teach people wrongly in a perfumery course saying this sample which is analyzed has no synthetics when it has is lying, and this is not INSINUATING ANY COMPANY, suppose you are my student and sent me a vial from any company saying to me please analyze it for me and paid me to analyze it, would you like if i lyingly told you it is 100% natural even it has synthetics, specially when you are learning?
A question to ponder….

Cool, but perception is subjective though, if I received a sample, took one whiff of it, and say....man this smell like there's some toxic waste in it, does it make it a fact? A subjective opinion and scientific analysis are two completely different things as well, it simply cannot be based on personal hypothesis, opinion, and perception.

 

[bigbloke]

Anybody tried zafran sultan?...

Homeros attar homeros PP....which is better when applied and settled?

Finally got round to jotting some thoughts down:

Zafran Sultan
This doesn’t mess around. Right off the bat it’s pungent and in your face. You’re hit with Saffron (not too piercing, so done right in my book), some creaminess, lots of musk and the Agallocha (Hindi?) oud is plentiful, not barnyard but the resinous fermented note is there.
The floral element is almost Jasmine-like but is actually the Rose 1978. There are some spicy notes, not pickle but sort of like garam masala. The powerful opening dies down relatively quickly and goes into cruise control at 60mph if that makes any sense. It does a bit of shape shifting on my skin, with different notes taking center stage.

You can pick out the individual parts if you pay attention, otherwise it’s very much an experience as a whole. It’s not overly floral at all on my skin, the rose serves as a settler of the other notes; I get a lot of Saffron and oud, and then sandalwood. I didn’t find it a ‘wow, what is this?!’ type scent, much more of a comforting and relaxing experience despite the punchy opening.

I’d say with time this will become much smoother, the oud settling into more leather and hay, the saffron being tamed more and I can’t see the sandalwood doing much more developing.

 

[Mak-7]

It doesnt make it a fact, but an important observation.
For me, un-scientific, but usually a very good method to spot harsh chemicals is how perfume dries down on me or on my shirt the next day.
So far, all that did that are out of my wardrobe.
Speaking of Ensar - i never found anything bad in drydown, and it always faded away revealing new notes that wont be obvious while wearing on skin.

 

[thescenttherapy]

Question:

If a perfume contains the natural ingredients with added perfume enhancers for added longevity, stability and projection, would it still be considered a natural perfume?

Or must it contain all natural ingredients?

 

[Xcaliber6685]

Question:

If a perfume contains the natural ingredients with added perfume enhancers for added longevity, stability and projection, would it still be considered a natural perfume?

Or must it contain all natural ingredients?

Even adding a few drops of synthetic would automatically disqualify that release from being 100% Natural, it would be a mixed media composition when synthetic is being incorporated into the scent profile, however small the amount being added.

IMO....ALL-natural means 100%, if it's not all, then it ain't 100%, and 99% still ain't 100% LOL For transparency's sake, the perfumer should disclose it.

 

[epigeneticmutant]

following up to see how this discussion proceeded, i must say, it really sounds like very small amounts of specific synthetics cleverly and carefully added into a otherwise natural perfume may be essentially impossible for noses to discriminate, of course this is just my speculation, but i feel quite confident that most of us probably aren't as talented as we'd like to believe at picking out the less obvious synthetics that may even mimic natural materials and be the identical molecules but made in a lab. to be fair, even if we wanted to compare a group of master noses to a group of rookie noses, it'd take a lot of trials and a lot of different perfumes that are all natural vs natural with a bit of synthetics (not obvious ones that are obviously distinct smells not found in nature) to really generate any worthy statistics to analyze and draw conclusions from and compare our null hypothesis to alternative hypothesis. with a guess being a binary choice, it wouldn't be hard for many of us to just get lucky in our first few guesses but over more trials show our noses limitations and inability to recognize. at some point i wonder does it even matter? even if a vendor lied to you or didn't, unless you can confidently pinpoint some sort of genuine physiological allergy to specific synthetic additives used, i don't really see what it matters, i'm sure a lot of things we own we either overly doubt or overly take at face value while genius marketing and our senses fool us.